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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;for the lolz&#8221;: 4chan is hacking the attention economy</title>
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	<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html</link>
	<description>making connections where none previously existed</description>
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		<title>By: Anon</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-448796</link>
		<dc:creator>Anon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 22 Sep 2010 18:14:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-448796</guid>
		<description>rules 1 &amp; 2
you broke them
GTFO</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>rules 1 &amp; 2<br />
you broke them<br />
GTFO</p>
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		<title>By: Eddie VIII</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-212341</link>
		<dc:creator>Eddie VIII</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Jul 2010 17:13:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-212341</guid>
		<description>- the majority of responses offer little to the conversation, i will fix that

(1) 4chan/b/ has developed into a HUMOR and ENTERTAINMENT site inspired by hacker culture. i am not a hacker, but i like technology, blackhumor, and netculture, so i like 4chan. 

(2) there will always be at least two aspects to any culture - the ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT side and the TECHNICAL HARDWORK side. let me illustrate:

SKATEBOARDING culture - Making a sk8 video  (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. skinning knees learning new trick with friends (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)

MUSICAL culture - Putting on a great stage show (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. practicing chord changes (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)

ARTISTIC culture - Gallery showing (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. dozens of sketches planning a painting (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)

HACKER culture - 4chan (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. writing real codes / cracks (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)

(3) Attention economy = mainstreaming and there&#039;s nothing wrong with it. It is difficult to see powerful ideas generated in underground communities (that really feel like they
are owned by their “inside” group of creators) are becoming
popularized - and it seems strange and almost a bit hurtful to the
creating crew.

Exhibit A:
My wife and I were in high school in the early and mid 90s. We
were ostracized and teased by students there - we were nerdy and
talented, we dressed &quot;funny&quot; and listened to &quot;strange&quot; music. We
literally experienced Nirvana&#039;s transition from underground fave to
mainstream culture. It was really weird when the frat boys started
going to Lollapalooza. A few years later we experienced the Green Day
punk-era mainstreaming. We were like &quot;Hot Topic WTF? Dying your hair
is popular WTF? Everyone wears Doc Martens now WTF?&quot;

Exhibit B:
My friends and I made zines in jr high / high school. Private presses
like that were nowhere to be found  but in our bedrooms and midnight
runs to Kinkos – and we had to trade them through the mail with other
zinesters. Today, it is almost a required expression of individuality
to have a public blog or vlog.

Exhibit C:
There are tons of other cultural - fashion, language, art, music - trends that have
exploded from the underground (see blue jeans, beat writers, art
nouveau, hip hop, and HACKER CULTURE).

FINAL POINT:
Great ideas are memetic. And that&#039;s OK.  4chan’s creativity will feed
cheezburger/netculture. And that&#039;s OK. urbandictionary will be used in courts of
law. And that&#039;s OK. References to videos on Rutter&#039;s list have ended
up on Tosh.O. And that&#039;s OK (i think the show is hilarious).

Go ahead and let the adult capitalists earn $ from the awesome ideas
of youth. It happens all the time and it&#039;s nothing new. I think it&#039;s
pretty apparent anyway that monetary and intellectual economies are
shifting with the rise of DIY&#039;s power (Creative Commons, wikis,
zazzle, etc). Attention economy will shift as well. Hacker culture will mainstream (unless in your opinion it already has). 

Whatever.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>- the majority of responses offer little to the conversation, i will fix that</p>
<p>(1) 4chan/b/ has developed into a HUMOR and ENTERTAINMENT site inspired by hacker culture. i am not a hacker, but i like technology, blackhumor, and netculture, so i like 4chan. </p>
<p>(2) there will always be at least two aspects to any culture &#8211; the ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT side and the TECHNICAL HARDWORK side. let me illustrate:</p>
<p>SKATEBOARDING culture &#8211; Making a sk8 video  (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. skinning knees learning new trick with friends (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)</p>
<p>MUSICAL culture &#8211; Putting on a great stage show (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. practicing chord changes (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)</p>
<p>ARTISTIC culture &#8211; Gallery showing (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. dozens of sketches planning a painting (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)</p>
<p>HACKER culture &#8211; 4chan (ARTISTIC AWESOMENESS 4 LULZ/ENTERTAINMENT) vs. writing real codes / cracks (TECHNICAL HARDWORK)</p>
<p>(3) Attention economy = mainstreaming and there&#8217;s nothing wrong with it. It is difficult to see powerful ideas generated in underground communities (that really feel like they<br />
are owned by their “inside” group of creators) are becoming<br />
popularized &#8211; and it seems strange and almost a bit hurtful to the<br />
creating crew.</p>
<p>Exhibit A:<br />
My wife and I were in high school in the early and mid 90s. We<br />
were ostracized and teased by students there &#8211; we were nerdy and<br />
talented, we dressed &#8220;funny&#8221; and listened to &#8220;strange&#8221; music. We<br />
literally experienced Nirvana&#8217;s transition from underground fave to<br />
mainstream culture. It was really weird when the frat boys started<br />
going to Lollapalooza. A few years later we experienced the Green Day<br />
punk-era mainstreaming. We were like &#8220;Hot Topic WTF? Dying your hair<br />
is popular WTF? Everyone wears Doc Martens now WTF?&#8221;</p>
<p>Exhibit B:<br />
My friends and I made zines in jr high / high school. Private presses<br />
like that were nowhere to be found  but in our bedrooms and midnight<br />
runs to Kinkos – and we had to trade them through the mail with other<br />
zinesters. Today, it is almost a required expression of individuality<br />
to have a public blog or vlog.</p>
<p>Exhibit C:<br />
There are tons of other cultural &#8211; fashion, language, art, music &#8211; trends that have<br />
exploded from the underground (see blue jeans, beat writers, art<br />
nouveau, hip hop, and HACKER CULTURE).</p>
<p>FINAL POINT:<br />
Great ideas are memetic. And that&#8217;s OK.  4chan’s creativity will feed<br />
cheezburger/netculture. And that&#8217;s OK. urbandictionary will be used in courts of<br />
law. And that&#8217;s OK. References to videos on Rutter&#8217;s list have ended<br />
up on Tosh.O. And that&#8217;s OK (i think the show is hilarious).</p>
<p>Go ahead and let the adult capitalists earn $ from the awesome ideas<br />
of youth. It happens all the time and it&#8217;s nothing new. I think it&#8217;s<br />
pretty apparent anyway that monetary and intellectual economies are<br />
shifting with the rise of DIY&#8217;s power (Creative Commons, wikis,<br />
zazzle, etc). Attention economy will shift as well. Hacker culture will mainstream (unless in your opinion it already has). </p>
<p>Whatever.</p>
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		<title>By: @netwurker</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-163466</link>
		<dc:creator>@netwurker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jul 2010 05:41:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-163466</guid>
		<description>&quot;...Information becomes pliable in ways that challenge the perceived authority of institutions. The concept of narrative deforms as:

    * lifestreaming transmogrifies entertainment
    * game platforms employ transmedia, simulation and agency.

Narrative progression repositions the representational towards the freeform [think: paidia as opposed to ludic]. An instance of this information deformation in action is troll play [or uncontrolled play]. A social example of troll play is found in the wiki Encyclopedia Dramatica which:

    &#039;…satirizes both encyclopedic topics and current events, especially those related to or relevant to internet culture. The wiki has been the subject of media attention given its focus on trolling and use of shock value, as well as its criticism of other Internet communities. It is also associated with the Internet subculture Anonymous.&#039;

_Encyclopedia Dramatica_ – and the affiliated imageboard/meme propagation site 4chan - showcase the challenge faced by narrative frameworks.  Platforms like _Encyclopedia Dramatica_ encourage troll-based comedic intent. Users remix absurd, and sometimes taboo, content. In particular, invasion boards like _4chan_ utilize shock networking*: where social content attempts to subvert social codas through deliberate agitation. In comparison with established narrative conventions, platforms like _Encyclopedia Dramatica_ offer an experimental system which bypasses strict censorship and ethical constraints. These platforms cater for unfiltered interactions that operate via immediacy-of-response. They are highly idiosyncratic in execution and linguistic formation: censorship and moderation may be limited or non-existent. The output is propagative, with contributors encouraged to riff and rip-off, replace, and even delete content. Narrative is deformed beyond a sequential structure whereby the climax or pay-off event becomes the spectacle:

An example of such modification is Copypasta, which consists of repeatedly copying and pasting blocks of text designed to evoke a heightened emotional response:

    &#039;A time-tested classic. This ending usually comes into play at the climax of a very troubling or exciting situation. Rather than resolve the story, one of the characters will abruptly say something to the effect of “I had Reese’s for breakfast.” At this point, the other character will completely forget about his/her worries and jump into the corresponding commercial dialogue, enamored by the peanut butter and chocolaty goodness that is Reese’s Puffs cereal. “It’s Reese’s… for breakfast!&quot;&#039;

_Copypasta_ derails notions of story or plot progression, resolution or dénouement. It embodies context-counteraction* and meme perpetuation. Dramatic intent shifts to reiterative moments containing affectivity spiking which ignores the rigors of institutionalized framing [think: morality, hierarchy or ownership]...&quot;
http://arsvirtuafoundation.org/research/2009/07/24/_social-tesseracting_-part-3/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8230;Information becomes pliable in ways that challenge the perceived authority of institutions. The concept of narrative deforms as:</p>
<p>    * lifestreaming transmogrifies entertainment<br />
    * game platforms employ transmedia, simulation and agency.</p>
<p>Narrative progression repositions the representational towards the freeform [think: paidia as opposed to ludic]. An instance of this information deformation in action is troll play [or uncontrolled play]. A social example of troll play is found in the wiki Encyclopedia Dramatica which:</p>
<p>    &#8216;…satirizes both encyclopedic topics and current events, especially those related to or relevant to internet culture. The wiki has been the subject of media attention given its focus on trolling and use of shock value, as well as its criticism of other Internet communities. It is also associated with the Internet subculture Anonymous.&#8217;</p>
<p>_Encyclopedia Dramatica_ – and the affiliated imageboard/meme propagation site 4chan &#8211; showcase the challenge faced by narrative frameworks.  Platforms like _Encyclopedia Dramatica_ encourage troll-based comedic intent. Users remix absurd, and sometimes taboo, content. In particular, invasion boards like _4chan_ utilize shock networking*: where social content attempts to subvert social codas through deliberate agitation. In comparison with established narrative conventions, platforms like _Encyclopedia Dramatica_ offer an experimental system which bypasses strict censorship and ethical constraints. These platforms cater for unfiltered interactions that operate via immediacy-of-response. They are highly idiosyncratic in execution and linguistic formation: censorship and moderation may be limited or non-existent. The output is propagative, with contributors encouraged to riff and rip-off, replace, and even delete content. Narrative is deformed beyond a sequential structure whereby the climax or pay-off event becomes the spectacle:</p>
<p>An example of such modification is Copypasta, which consists of repeatedly copying and pasting blocks of text designed to evoke a heightened emotional response:</p>
<p>    &#8216;A time-tested classic. This ending usually comes into play at the climax of a very troubling or exciting situation. Rather than resolve the story, one of the characters will abruptly say something to the effect of “I had Reese’s for breakfast.” At this point, the other character will completely forget about his/her worries and jump into the corresponding commercial dialogue, enamored by the peanut butter and chocolaty goodness that is Reese’s Puffs cereal. “It’s Reese’s… for breakfast!&#8221;&#8216;</p>
<p>_Copypasta_ derails notions of story or plot progression, resolution or dénouement. It embodies context-counteraction* and meme perpetuation. Dramatic intent shifts to reiterative moments containing affectivity spiking which ignores the rigors of institutionalized framing [think: morality, hierarchy or ownership]&#8230;&#8221;<br />
<a href="http://arsvirtuafoundation.org/research/2009/07/24/_social-tesseracting_-part-3/" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/arsvirtuafoundation.org/research/2009/07/24/_social-tesseracting_-part-3/?referer=');">http://arsvirtuafoundation.org/research/2009/07/24/_social-tesseracting_-part-3/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Alec Couros</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-142296</link>
		<dc:creator>Alec Couros</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2010 17:39:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-142296</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t know if you&#039;re following the latest 4chan vs. Oprah deal, but it&#039;s quite interesting. It&#039;s around &#039;Zach&#039;s Oprah Audition&#039; http://www.youtube.com/user/ZachAnner#p/u/3/T_35KKa3b1c and accusations of Oprah &amp; team cheating on the vote count. It seems as though 4chan may have now Google Bombed &quot;Oprah hates the handicapped&quot;.

http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&amp;source=hp&amp;q=oprah+hates+the+handicapped&amp;aq=f&amp;aqi=&amp;aql=&amp;oq=&amp;gs_rfai=&amp;fp=6d37eea865434957

At least, these are events as derived from popular posts on Reddit &amp; Digg - not sure what has actually happened.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t know if you&#8217;re following the latest 4chan vs. Oprah deal, but it&#8217;s quite interesting. It&#8217;s around &#8216;Zach&#8217;s Oprah Audition&#8217; <a href="http://www.youtube.com/user/ZachAnner#p/u/3/T_35KKa3b1c" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.youtube.com/user/ZachAnner_p/u/3/T_35KKa3b1c?referer=');">http://www.youtube.com/user/ZachAnner#p/u/3/T_35KKa3b1c</a> and accusations of Oprah &amp; team cheating on the vote count. It seems as though 4chan may have now Google Bombed &#8220;Oprah hates the handicapped&#8221;.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&#038;source=hp&#038;q=oprah+hates+the+handicapped&#038;aq=f&#038;aqi=&#038;aql=&#038;oq=&#038;gs_rfai=&#038;fp=6d37eea865434957" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/www.google.ca/_hl=en_038_source=hp_038_q=oprah+hates+the+handicapped_038_aq=f_038_aqi=_038_aql=_038_oq=_038_gs_rfai=_038_fp=6d37eea865434957?referer=');">http://www.google.ca/#hl=en&#038;source=hp&#038;q=oprah+hates+the+handicapped&#038;aq=f&#038;aqi=&#038;aql=&#038;oq=&#038;gs_rfai=&#038;fp=6d37eea865434957</a></p>
<p>At least, these are events as derived from popular posts on Reddit &amp; Digg &#8211; not sure what has actually happened.</p>
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		<title>By: anon</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-119941</link>
		<dc:creator>anon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 07:39:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-119941</guid>
		<description>i lol&#039;d :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i lol&#8217;d <img src='http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Justin Bacon</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-118946</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin Bacon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jun 2010 00:32:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-118946</guid>
		<description>This is my first time on your blog and I have to say I really love this post.  Your turn of phrase &quot;hacking the attention economy&quot; is quite delightful.  At the end of last year I wrote a post (one of a few) where I briefly touched on the notion that the &quot;attention economy&quot; is shifting to that of a &quot;conversation economy&quot; - your post here got me to thinking about this in  whole new way all over again.  Perhaps I was a bit too idealistic or perhaps Att&#039;nEcon Hackers just have more work to do.  In any case, thanks for a thought provoking bit of &quot;connecting the dots&quot;.  Here&#039;s a link to my post for reference.  Should you care take a minute, just the last couple paragraphs are all that are really relevant: http://blog.justinbacon.net/tag/conversationeconomy</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is my first time on your blog and I have to say I really love this post.  Your turn of phrase &#8220;hacking the attention economy&#8221; is quite delightful.  At the end of last year I wrote a post (one of a few) where I briefly touched on the notion that the &#8220;attention economy&#8221; is shifting to that of a &#8220;conversation economy&#8221; &#8211; your post here got me to thinking about this in  whole new way all over again.  Perhaps I was a bit too idealistic or perhaps Att&#8217;nEcon Hackers just have more work to do.  In any case, thanks for a thought provoking bit of &#8220;connecting the dots&#8221;.  Here&#8217;s a link to my post for reference.  Should you care take a minute, just the last couple paragraphs are all that are really relevant: <a href="http://blog.justinbacon.net/tag/conversationeconomy" rel="nofollow" onclick="pageTracker._trackPageview('/outgoing/blog.justinbacon.net/tag/conversationeconomy?referer=');">http://blog.justinbacon.net/tag/conversationeconomy</a></p>
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		<title>By: Gabriel Radic</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-118666</link>
		<dc:creator>Gabriel Radic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 23:23:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-118666</guid>
		<description>How can I be the first one here?

Where are the hoards of trolls?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How can I be the first one here?</p>
<p>Where are the hoards of trolls?</p>
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		<title>By: Anne Collier</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-117381</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne Collier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 14:57:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-117381</guid>
		<description>Think it was 4chan&#039;s embedding porn in &quot;G-rated&quot; YouTube videos that got some of the 1st mainstream attention. RE your update, imagine some parents would recognize &quot;lolz&quot; more readily, because kids will text &quot;lol lol lol,&quot; they&#039;ll say it out loud on Xbox Live in a sarcastic way (at least my kid does). I haven&#039;t heard &quot;lul lul lul.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Think it was 4chan&#8217;s embedding porn in &#8220;G-rated&#8221; YouTube videos that got some of the 1st mainstream attention. RE your update, imagine some parents would recognize &#8220;lolz&#8221; more readily, because kids will text &#8220;lol lol lol,&#8221; they&#8217;ll say it out loud on Xbox Live in a sarcastic way (at least my kid does). I haven&#8217;t heard &#8220;lul lul lul.&#8221;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: ash</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-116431</link>
		<dc:creator>ash</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 04:12:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-116431</guid>
		<description>Well written from headline to update. Nice work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well written from headline to update. Nice work.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony Comstock</title>
		<link>http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/archives/2010/06/12/for-the-lolz-4chan-is-hacking-the-attention-economy.html/comment-page-1#comment-116416</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony Comstock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jun 2010 03:51:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.zephoria.org/thoughts/?p=2711#comment-116416</guid>
		<description>&quot;Hacking the attention economy&quot; Hmmm? I think I like it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Hacking the attention economy&#8221; Hmmm? I think I like it!</p>
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